Tuesday, September 23, 2008

HEROES, Season 3 Villains- Episodes 1 & 2

I started this week's discussion

I saw some good things and some not so good things. The future Peter storyline and THE FORMULA storyline could get disastrous as could current Peter in the new body. I just hope they don’t leave things hanging- including the undisclosed guys who want the Formula in Germany. I would have liked to have seen Micah/family in New Orleans or Molly if not just to see where they are in all this. Here’s my take on the peeps:

The Good

So Nicki/Jessica were triplets? Huh. I like that this one is good...but where Nicki manifested Jessica (or was it the other way around?) Presumably because of their close connection, it will be interesting to see if this new one will manifest both of them now that she has used her power (I get the impression that she was using "form of an icicle" for the first time last nite. Hopefully this isn’t a memory loss kind of thing. Will we get to see a showdown between her and Claire’s Mom? Micah is going to be interesting in this scenario too.

Current Claire can't feel pain anymore? She can just be discovered more easily then? I’m guessing she is “the light”?

Parkman- he has been a constant good throughout the show, always trying to do the right thing (much how Peter starts out) Butterfly Effect? Landing him in the middle of Africa should have an interesting effect. His new friend in Africa is interesting too… that he paints and sees the future the same way as our first comic book artist… maybe he doesn’t really see the future or maybe he absorbs powers too?

Current Hiro- still trying to fulfill his destiny to save the world. Where is his sister? Why isn’t she helping him run the company?

Current Ando-poor guy can't catch a break. All he wants to do is help Hiro

Maya- she laid down pretty fast for Mohinder is all I’m saying. You would think that after Sylar she’d have a little more discretion. Do she and Mohinder have a kid and that kid is “the light”?

Horn-rimmed Glasses: Hunting down the bad guys/protecting his family… good guy.

The Undecided

Future Claire/Future Ando/Future Hiro- our opinions of these guys now shape how we see them in the future, so maybe they were not as good or bad as they seemed to turn out in the future. I like that Ando has Elle's power now.

Current Peter- what is his deal? He always tries to do the right thing? A different body is going to stop him now? We don’t even know if/how his powers will work in the new body? Does he still have his old ones or his old ones plus the new guys? What is the new guys’ power?

Future Peter-we already know he shot his brother, why couldn't he have gone back a little farther and just explained to his brother what the future looks like if Nathan revealed everything? I'm not convinced that his always trying to go back and save the world based on different histories doesn't mean there are not 10 future versions of himself running around in the present.

The Speedster/Catwoman- Hiro has placed her as a catwoman/ bad guy in ouir minds but she might juist be a fast Oliver Twist with a heart of gold? But Hiro has placed her in our minds as the “sexy” nemesis he’s always attracted to already.

Mrs. Petrelli/Linderman- I’m not convinced that these two (if Linderman isn’t a figment of Nathan’s imagination) are bad. Is the company such a bad thing? Also, is Hiro’s dad really dead if Linderman isn’t dead? Maybe Linderman got that invisibility power from the former partner of horn-rimmed glasses? Certainly suspect that she hasn’t revealed who her son is (she did the same thing to Claire!)

Nathan Petrelli- I don’t trust anyone who is overly zealous. Plus he’s in politics-that automatically makes him suspect. And, we know he has a dark side already. Which way will he go?

Mohinder- dude, what’s with the being good then all of a sudden turning into Dr. Moreau/Spiderman?

Elle- She could go nuttier or she could end up being a good guy, too soon to tell.

The Villains

Sylar- Okay, how long is that table going to hold him. I think not much longer. But, I’d like the world to play out without him in it for a while. He’s Nathan and Peter’s brother? That changes things. Right? When does Peter spend enough time around him that he can see how people “work” Will his connection to the Petrellis make him a “good guy” option?

Escapees- Okay so they’ve been locked up, have been torturing people already, but we don’t know them individually, maybe their motivations are different from what we think?

Okay- Thoughts?


Anonymous said...

Frank commented first:

All good points.

I liked it last night. I convinced myself that Season 2 was 'good enough' and to not let it taint the new season. I think this season started out cool. Remember in the last few seasons when they'd talk about all these powers, but you never actually saw anyone fighting or even using them for more than a few seconds? Last night we saw powers all over the place - I hope they continue this and that its not just because its a premier.

Mohinder - liked what happend to him, even tho it was painfully obvious it was going to happen. I would have liked it to have waited until the 3rd or 4th episode, tho. Would have been a good revelation. I wish his metamorphosis would have stuck with heightened senses - like he can hear/see/etc better... then the next day even more... until he finally has to don a mask w/earplugs and glasses/etc to fight off the senses. The transformation into the Mohinder as the ultimate villain would be a fun one to watch - obsessing about power and donning a supervillain suit. ...but, I think he'll just be a tourtered soul who will transform into something and then regret taking the powerade. ...who can climb walls.

per the timeline jumping, JJ and I had a email discussion yesterday where we discussed the fact that if you have a time traveler, you really lose your vested interest in any of the characters because you know, as the viewer, you could always travel back before anything bad happened and at least adjust what happened. And with 2 time travelers, well, all the paradoxes get mixed together and there's really nothing to worry about. (I also thought it was a copout that they made it so Hiro doesn't actually 'stop' time... cmon, we saw fruit and stuff stuck in mid air in previous seasons.) Anyway, with time travel and a self healer, good luck adding tension. I mentioned to JJ that we, as the human race, should lock Hiro and Claire in a room. Anything bad happenes, Hiro goes back and changes it all. Claire would just be for company.

While Parkman's friend in the desert was a surprise, a talking turtle would have been better.

Finally, I'm glad we finally found a weakness in Sylar. The world's top science research prison built to hold super powerful villains can't hold him, but hide behind a slotted closet door locked tight by a belt, and he's powerless.

Anonymous said...

JJ replied:

well, i thought last season of Heroes was so awful they really didn't have anywhere to go but up.... at least that is what i hoped.

i thought last night's premier did a very good job of redeeming the show for this season, at least for now. i still have a few issues, but overall i thought they jumped right in, had a lot going on right away, and gave some satisfying pay offs to the audience sooner rather than later. the set ups for the rest of the season weren't bad, but we'll see how they play out.

i loved that they got right to who shot Nathan. no huge mystery dragged out for several episodes. We know it was future Peter and that he should not have done it. We also learned what Mama Petrelli's power is, we got the long awaited event of Syler acquiring Claire's power (which was utterly disgusting and gave us a great set up for her being "special" -- just like Walt on L O S T), and we offed somebody right away with Elle's daddy getting sliced. a lot happening immediately which has always been Heroes weakest area in my opinion: nothing happens. this was the exact opposite. good for them.

XinhXan also thought that Mohinder behavior did not stick to how his character has behaved up until this point... i think we can explain it by simply seeing his character as a human being who envies the heroes and their powers, instead of the cold science and logic only Spock type character that would be totally boring. injecting him with some typical human behavior i think gives him an inner struggle instead of just rambling on all the time about test tubes and petre dishes. blah blah blah.

i really dug what they were doing with Nathan. i love that he had a literal resurrection and then a spiritual one on top of it, that Nathan could have a radical change and still be who he is could be very cool. I was afraid that Heroes is going to bore us with no ever really dying because they can always be saved with Claire-blood, but at least for now they are keeping it interesting. that will get old fast though... one thing i really liked about the first season (and LO S T does this too) is that they would play both sides with science and God and what everything that is happening to the characters means both from a scientific approach and a spiritual one. they did that very well in these first two hours, something that was sorely missing in season 2. i did not like Linderman being back in the picture and a figment of Nathan's imagination / he's "crazy" now. that is too much like the Niki/Jessica story for me and also negates his spiritual transformation in my opinion, so that stinks. we'll see what they do with it....

hate that Ali Larter is still on the show. can't we get rid of her for good? has she been resurrected with Claire-blood, too or could she be the real Jessica (Niki's real sister) and she in fact never died, but was taken by the company and used to "handle" powerful politicians? either way, Ali Larter stinks....

the future Peter/present Peter trapped in the bald guy storyline could get so confusing so fast that it might kill the audience.... your average viewer might not like that and tune out if it becomes so complicated to track two different people who are the same person in two different timelines, plus Hiro's timeline on top of that. could be amazing, but it could also really get away from the writer's and fast if they aren't super careful. Buzz and i were talking timeline's yesterday and it appears Heroes is trying to inject some more L O S T influence here with the time jumping angle by having the characters bring up destiny a lot. Mama Petrelli and the African dude who finds Parkman were both spouting pretty heavy about people not being where they were "supposed" to be and thngs happening the way they do for a reason. L O S T does the same thing with many characters talking about fate and that things happen for a reason. perhaps this will create a new and interesting arc in the season that the overall story isn't so much "saving the world" as it is "you can't change your destiny." in Peter's future from both season 1 and this new season, he bears a huge scare on his face. is this our not so subtle clue that these characters can't escape their fate or alter the future as much as they thingk they can....

finally, they did some things that were exact repeats of things they did in season 1, but i will lay that aside and say they are just trying to build on top of what worked for them in season 1. at least i hope that the case....

Anonymous said...

Jamie says:

I really thought last night's episodes were pretty good - not necessarily from a 'stand alone perspective', but they did a good job of getting multiple new story lines started.

I'll try to be brief and just toss in a few thoughts about things:

Ali Larter - I agree with J.J. Why is she still on the show? I tried not to be a hater, but after 2 full seasons I feel like you could cut out all of her scenes and nothing would be missing from the show. Maybe this is some sort of re-boot to her character. I'm not sure if this new personality/amnesia/whatever plus a different power will stop me from being bored every time she opens her mouth, but at least it is a different direction.

Usually I'm a fan of time travel in shows and "seeing the dark future that must be changed"...but is it starting to be used a little too much? Seems like every story line has that as a focus point and I would like to see something different for a change.

I don't know about this whole "Present Peter trapped in a new body thing". I was fine with it until the end, when suddenly it switched to where we (the viewer) could see Peter, but the reflection and his break out buddies still saw the 'convict scary guy'. I feel like they were trying to dumb it down so the viewer knew it was "Present Peter", but I thought that was unnecessary and confused me for the first 30 seconds of the scene as I thought he had transformed back somehow.

I also didn't like how Mohinder (not even going to try and spell that one) has been the voice of reason so far in the series, then suddenly he gets the superpowers in a shot and is like "screw everything! Let's get these molecules inside of me!" I would have liked it better if they did it slowly and showed him maybe testing on animals (not that I generally encourage animal testing....) and watching a monkey fly (you know, like the Wizard of Oz) and slowly start to think it is safe and then get jealous and inject himself or something.

But overall I was pleased to see multiple new directions happening. I am curious to see how it will all play out and come back together (hopefully) like Season 1 ended up.

Anonymous said...

Frank responds:

I know I already had my turn, but I liked the way they used Ali Larter last night - twist #1 was that she wasnt Nikki OR Jessica, the way she got pissed at the reporter, and finally twist #2 was that she froze him, wtf did that come from?? Larter being a bad actress or not, I thought her character was well used.

Anonymous said...

no. the only good thing about those Larter scenes was they used it to get William Katt on the show! The Greatest American Hero

Anonymous said...

I say:

I’m with Frank… I liked the new direction for Ali Larter, the only question for me is whether it is actually Nicki/Jessica or if it is a triplet… a third daughter? I hope it isn’t an amnesia/Nicki/Jessica story. Change her if you want to keep her and make her go on as a new person.

Anonymous said...

I add:

Sorry, one more thing to add… if they can’t change their future, then Mrs. Petrelli’s words were fairly prophetic… something to the effect that every future she dreams of, Peter is the one who ruins it?

Anonymous said...


Sounds like something my dad would say to me, dreams or not.

Anonymous said...


i believe Niki is dead. we saw her get blown up in New Orleans and this new Ali Larter has a completely different power we know Niki didn't have. IF it's her sister Jessica who may have never really died, it makes sense that that sister would also have a power... perhaps she doesn't know her true identity and really believes she is this Traci person. either way, her character is yet again an unlikable tramp type girl who manipulates people to get ahead. boring. at least to me it's boring. if Buzz is right that it isn't Niki, isn't Jessica and isn't a triplet, then i guess there really aren't that many struggling actresses in Hollywood trying to break into acting. we'll just cast the same actress we had to play a completely new person who happens to look EXACTLY like a character we just killed off... what? who does that? Ali Larter is definitely liked by someone on the Heroes production staff.

Anonymous said...


OK, I’m finally weighing in. Overall I liked the season premiere, and generally agree with most of the comments so far. Here are some additional thoughts:

I think this old Peter in another body thing is going to start to suck really quickly…its just dumb. The only good part of it is that the guy whose body he has was Weevil on Veronica Mars, so that’s another good VM actor with a job (for now). And scar Peter/evil Claire from the future also have some major irritation potential.

V. curious to see how Ando turns evil, if that’s what really happens. And the part where Hiro opened the safe and another dvd told him “I told you not to open the safe” actually made me laugh out loud. The formula is clearly this season’s “find the sword” quest.

Not sure about the Parkman/Africa storyline…is this going to be this season’s version of the Hiro in Japan thing? And what are they going to do for Season 4, send Claire to Australia?

Love how Mama Petrelli will be the new head of the company…she is such a fantastic character. Is Sylar really her son or was that just a figure of speech, as in “I’m your mama now, kid and you’ll do what I say”?

As for Niki/Jessica/Traci, who knows what the story is and I’m not sure if I care. I liked that this new power seems to be unrelated to the Niki/Jessica thing…so maybe she is just a completely new character who happens to be a double for Niki/Jessica? I agree JJ – someone at Heroes LOVES Ali Larter a little too much.

Nathan – how did Linderman heal him if he is imaginary? What’s up with that?

Here’s the thing about Heroes…looking back it is starting to look like they recycle/retread a lot of the same themes over again. Like Hiro’s quest to find something…another “save the world” thing that involves views of the future…etc. etc. That may prove to be its undoing, as I think just changing certain details but keeping the same themes/goals over and over again may get old. But it is early in the season and I’ll stay tuned to see what happened.

Anonymous said...


I don't think Niki is dead. We saw her be in a building that blew up last season, but we didn't see a body or a funeral or anything , so in TV land I think that means she is still alive. I think Jessica has to be dead though, we saw her grave and it wouldn't make sense how Jessica could still be alive yet inside of Niki's body at the same time.

I think the explosion roughed up Niki, everyone assumed she died, but she was actually rescued by the company. They implanted a new memory in her and altered her powers somehow. I think this would make sense since they already had some experience in altering her DNA or whatever to make her powers go away last season.

But it was good to see they kept her Super Sl*t powers intact.

Anonymous said...


to jump off of what Julia just said - what kind of power did Peter acquire that enables him to put someone inside another person? what kind of screwy power is that? the demonic possession power? how does he get Peter out of that guy? where's his real body? he can't literally be inside that guy. are present day Peter and the bald guy warring over the dude's will like Steve Martin and Lilly Tomlin in All of Me? that whole thing is just silly to me....

Anonymous said...


When the were going thru the villains, dont remember if it was on a computer or thru the files, they came to the guy who Peter is "in", and Bennet didn't mention was his power was, only that it was 'too horrible to imagine' or something - but onscreen (must have been a computer) it said something like "SOUND AUGMENTATION" or something about controlling sound. Cant imagine what that would be (maybe an ability to play Micheal Bolton ("You must be his biggest fan!") at a very loud volume or something).

Anonymous said...


I completely agree...this whole thing needs more explanation. It just seems ridiculous right now.

Oh, and Mohinder and Maya...if they have a baby, would its power be that it is the most annoying child on the planet? And the Mohinder as the Fly...kind of gross.

Anonymous said...


we could have Jeff Goldblum come in and be an imaginary friend for Mohinder and they could peal body parts off of one another

and i saw that "Sound Modulation" or whatever thing, too, Buzz. maybe the bald guy not only blasts Michael Bolton, but Kenny G and Josh Groben as well to wreak havoc on the world. definitely keep that guy locked up.

Anonymous said...

Josh Groben gained a few points with me for his medley of theme songs during the Emmy's (yea, I watched it, big whoop). Him singing the South Park theme song was dead on.

Probably not going to happen, but I want to have it written down so I can say "I told you so". We still need a dinosaur for Hiro to fight, yes? Mohinder has scales on his back now, or so it may seem. Mohindersaur. You heard it here first.